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bar4d
05-15-05, 06:07 PM
Congrats from a Boise State fan on another Baylor trip to the sweet sixteen. We lost a close one to Tex A & M yesterday. The 4-0 score was closer than that.

Question. Why are there no Americans on your women's team...and only one on your men's team?

Just curious, but somehow that doesn't seem quite right.

We gave you guys a good match earlier in the year. Took the doubles point if I remember right and a bunch of first sets in the singles.

Our team will be much better next year and we are coming after you. The General's Army is on the move.

caesarscott
05-15-05, 06:09 PM
why are you a xenophobe? back to boise, with you. QUICK

GovernorBill
05-15-05, 06:16 PM
...when it comes to building a program that had absolutely no history or tradition and was bottom of the barrel. Knoll's plan for building Baylor into a national power in tennis has been quickly adopted by other college's that aspire to be a national power in tennis--see Corpus Christi A&M and Texas Tech.

Oddly enough, our basketball coach is utilizing this philosophy to circumvent the bad press we received during the recent men's basketball fiasco.

I actually think using foreign players is a great thing, and fits nicely with Baylor's mission to not only be a national university but an international university.

jumpinjoe
05-15-05, 06:35 PM
You can even look at the University of Texas program, which has a deep history of success in tennis, and see the use of the foreign player. Those names on their roster are not from Deleon, Texas.

bar4d
05-15-05, 06:52 PM
Xenophobe...A person unduly fearful or contemptuous of that which is foreign, especially of strangers or foreign peoples.

Nope...just concerned when NONE of the scholies go to Yanks.

sedonabear1
05-15-05, 06:59 PM
Xenophobe...A person unduly fearful or contemptuous of that which is foreign, especially of strangers or foreign peoples.

Nope...just concerned when NONE of the scholies go to Yanks.

I go to Boise often and love the area. When I am hikeing I run into a lot of people that are foreign. Why is that? I did enjoy the bowel game in December.

bar4d
05-15-05, 07:02 PM
The same thing happened in NCAA skiing, both x-country and alpine. Now there is a conserted effort to give at least half the scholies to Americans. There is no way to get around the issue. It isn't right. You have only one Yank on both teams.

At the spring tourney in Boise there were three teams with better than 90% foreign born kids. One was all foreign born. I won't name the team. They were rude, dirty, badly dressed, and knew every dirty trick in the game.

Thankfully our coach has openly commited to building a powerhouse team made up of all Americans.


...when it comes to building a program that had absolutely no history or tradition and was bottom of the barrel. Knoll's plan for building Baylor into a national power in tennis has been quickly adopted by other college's that aspire to be a national power in tennis--see Corpus Christi A&M and Texas Tech.

Oddly enough, our basketball coach is utilizing this philosophy to circumvent the bad press we received during the recent men's basketball fiasco.

I actually think using foreign players is a great thing, and fits nicely with Baylor's mission to not only be a national university but an international university.

jumpinjoe
05-15-05, 07:10 PM
I go to Boise often and love the area. When I am hikeing I run into a lot of people that are foreign. Why is that? I did enjoy the bowel game in December.

I can't let this go by....are you referring to your proctoscopic exam last year?

D. C. Bear
05-15-05, 07:16 PM
Nope...just concerned when NONE of the scholies go to Yanks.

Why? Are you paying for them?

If you don't like people from other countries coming to college in the US, that is your business, but don't expect others to follow your prejudices.

BCC97
05-15-05, 07:17 PM
This is a pretty uncredible post, even more so since it comes from a Boise State fan (which assumes he lived for at least a few years in the Boise area).

jumpinjoe
05-15-05, 07:19 PM
The foreign born athlete has been around for years. In track and field, the Univ of Arkansas has won the NCAA's many times over with distant runners from Great Britain.

Jamaica has provided sprinters, and Africa has provide distant runners for many a track program.

Many rosters are dotted with foreign born basketball players. Baylor is rebuilding its men's program with at least 4 foreigners, and the women had two.

Same can be said for swimming, and just about all sports except football.

Fact is, the USA provides some of the world's best coaching, training, facilities, and education, and these foreign born athletes know that this is a way to achieve their goals, not to say a four year vacation in the USA at the expense of the schools. Not a bad deal....

Africa....USA....Africa....USA.....Africa....USA.. ...what a choice....

caesarscott
05-15-05, 07:20 PM
The same thing happened in NCAA skiing, both x-country and alpine. Now there is a conserted effort to give at least half the scholies to Americans. There is no way to get around the issue. It isn't right. You have only one Yank on both teams.

At the spring tourney in Boise there were three teams with better than 90% foreign born kids. One was all foreign born. I won't name the team. They were rude, dirty, badly dressed, and knew every dirty trick in the game.

Thankfully our coach has openly commited to building a powerhouse team made up of all Americans.what kind of communist are you? why should we sign up inferior players when we can give somebody from another country a chance at an education and to become a champion? if good american tennis players don't want to come to waco, that's too bad.

and by the way, who uses the word "yank". are you british? no americans ever say that. not that it really matters.

Yogi
05-15-05, 07:23 PM
Thankfully our coach has openly commited to building a powerhouse team made up of all Americans.

Good for Boise State, and meanwhile, we will just keep winning national championships with anyone who wants to attend a World Class University.

bar4d
05-15-05, 08:00 PM
Yes, we have foreign born athletes on our teams also. Even tennis. BUT NOT THE ENTIRE MEN'S AND WOMEN'S TEAM, track or otherwise. Baylor should maintain a balance.

Baylor's National championships should have an *asterisk...

.... *team has no Americans.

As far as top American's wanting to play for Baylor. We'll take them, are taking them, since you aren't interested in them.

Watch whats happens to Boise State next year.

>
The foreign born athlete has been around for years. In track and field, the Univ of Arkansas has won the NCAA's many times over with distant runners from Great Britain.

Jamaica has provided sprinters, and Africa has provide distant runners for many a track program.

Many rosters are dotted with foreign born basketball players. Baylor is rebuilding its men's program with at least 4 foreigners, and the women had two.

Same can be said for swimming, and just about all sports except football.

Fact is, the USA provides some of the world's best coaching, training, facilities, and education, and these foreign born athletes know that this is a way to achieve their goals, not to say a four year vacation in the USA at the expense of the schools. Not a bad deal....

Africa....USA....Africa....USA.....Africa....USA.. ...what a choice....

BearChick
05-15-05, 08:09 PM
Watch whats happens to Boise State next year.

>

Glued to my seat.

bar4d
05-15-05, 08:10 PM
“They've accepted the fact that the Baylor men's team is going to kick their butts, but they're not used to us doing it,”.....“And they haven't accepted it.” Joey Scrivano Baylor Womens' Tennis Coach

Hmmm...one Canadian, one Bulgarian, two Czech's, two Germans, two Slovenians, and NO Americans.

BearChick
05-15-05, 08:22 PM
He didn't say the "made up of all Americans Baylor men's team", doofus. He said "the Baylor men's team", and if one Canadian, one Bulgarian, two Czech's, two Germans, two Slovenians happens to be the makeup, then so be it.

You are on your way to being the first Tennis Troll we've had on the board.

I understand the point you're trying to make, but let it go. Who cares? There's no "Made in the USA" rule for NCAA tennis. And again, our goal is to recruit the best athletes to Baylor, regardless of where their hometown is. We want the best and brightest at Baylor. And I daresay our entire university is enriched by having students from around the world suit up in the green and gold and sit in our classrooms as well.

Now, don't freak out here, but I took a German class in school, and the guy who sat next to me was a South African tennis player. He represented Baylor admirably, and to the best of my knowledge, the apocalypse didn't start with his arrival on campus.

Enjoy the potato state. We'll enjoy our national championships. Let me know how Boise State rips it up next year, okay? Like I said, I'm glued...riveted...to my seat by the prospects.

jumpinjoe
05-15-05, 08:24 PM
And they all think they have improved their lot in life by coming to Waco.

Wacoso
05-15-05, 08:31 PM
and they graduate, unlike anyone that goes to Boise State. You have what, 17% graduation rate for your entire school?

Old300Bear
05-15-05, 08:38 PM
As a Christian University one of our callings is to take Christ to the world. Our school song even speaks of flinging our green and gold afar. In tennis that is exactly what we are doing. Over the years many of the Baylor tennis players have stayed in our home when they come to Lubbock to play Texas Tech. Believe me, any school would love to have these young men among their students or as alumni. Now that we are establihed as a tennis powerhouse I think you will see more Americans on the team. Initially we couldn't get the top American players so we built our team with foreign players. I think we will continue with that tradition as long as they are really good players and good human beings. too.

bar4d
05-15-05, 08:50 PM
"..one Canadian, one Bulgarian, two Czech's, two Germans, two Slovenians, no Americans..." is the make up of the women's team, not the men's team. The men's team has one American, not in the rotation. You even took Fresno's #1, Greg Shearer from New Zealand, last year.

Sorry if I hit a nerve. Yep. I lived in Europe for several years, speak some German and Spanish. My best friend is a German Biermeister from Munchen. Educated in the US. That's not the point, Baylor should give American tennis players a chance. Until you do, your championships should carry an asterisk.

As far as next year, Boise State will be knocking. We have a great coach, one of the best in the country, and his tennis program is rising like a rocket.

jumpinjoe
05-15-05, 08:51 PM
LubBear, the way you started off, I thought you were going to say that the tennis creed is Matthew 28:19-20.

bar4d
05-15-05, 08:56 PM
I like that Fred. That makes sense. But your coach will have to arm wrestle our coach for those top American tennis kids. Hmmm...both guys and gals I hope? Got to get rid of that asterisk.


As a Christian University one of our callings is to take Christ to the world. Our school song even speaks of flinging our green and gold afar. In tennis that is exactly what we are doing. Over the years many of the Baylor tennis players have stayed in our home when they come to Lubbock to play Texas Tech. Believe me, any school would love to have these young men among their students or as alumni. Now that we are establihed as a tennis powerhouse I think you will see more Americans on the team. Initially we couldn't get the top American players so we built our team with foreign players. I think we will continue with that tradition as long as they are really good players and good human beings. too.

Wacoso
05-15-05, 09:10 PM
I like that Fred. That makes sense. But your coach will have to arm wrestle our coach for those top American tennis kids. Hmmm...both guys and gals I hope? Got to get rid of that asterisk.

When has Boise done **** in anything other than WAC football?

ginkgo4life
05-15-05, 09:11 PM
I like that Fred. That makes sense. But your coach will have to arm wrestle our coach for those top American tennis kids. Hmmm...both guys and gals I hope? Got to get rid of that asterisk.

I am sure you have a great coach and all, and I am not sure if you are talking your womens coach or your back for a second time men's coach, but not too many students choose between Idaho and Texas schools. I mean its only a 24 hour drive between the two. I imagine the only time we are going head to head with you for a recruit would be in Europe somewhere.

BSQ9261
05-15-05, 09:16 PM
I assume that Boise State only recruits Native Americans. If a team gets state money, then I guess they ought to recruit players from only from that state. Boise should only field Idaho players in each sport. UT and A&M should not recruit a basketball or football player from outside the state because they represent a state. Baylor, on the other hand, has an message that has no boundaries. It doesn;t hurt anything that they also that their backhands are world class, too.

D. C. Bear
05-15-05, 09:18 PM
bar4d,

That's not the point, Baylor should give American tennis players a chance. Until you do, your championships should carry an asterisk.

We have more than enough American students on campus. We also have many American students in our athletic department--including US Olympic gold winners Jeremy Wariner and Darold Williamson. (Who follow in the footsteps of US Olympic gold winner Michael Johnson).

No one is ruling out American tennis players, but if the international players we can sign are better than the American players we can sign, then it is up to the Americans to raise their game, not up to Baylor coaches to give them an affirmative action program.

If your coach isn't willing or able to sign the best players whatever their passports say, maybe you need to get a new coach. If he gets the best players by only signing US players, then quit complaining about the competition.

BCC97
05-15-05, 09:20 PM
Baylor should maintain a balance.
No one is looking at the roster, only the results. With that in mind, you should mind your own house, as it's seriously lacking in both accomplishments and recognition (only #31 in the nation?). Once the BS tennis team can beat some respectable teams (didn't see too many on the schedule - A&M Corpus may be the only one at #25 before the tournament)...or even beat a marginally good team on the road (is the Appleton Outdoors the only tennis courts in the Northwest?!), none of the BS fans have any credibility to say the tennis team is "rising like a rocket". I seriously doubt that 4-0 loss to the #16 team was any closer than the score indicated.

Here's a list of teams ranked higher than BS that Baylor has played and beaten this year on the way to a so far undefeated season (I'd love to add BS next year and give y'all the shelacking that is now deserved, but I don't make those decisions):
#2 UVA
#3 Florida
#13 Oklahoma State (twice)
#15 Texas Tech
#16 Texas A&M
#22 Stanford
#24 Cal
#25 A&M Corpus
#29 Texas (3 times)

btw - what color is the court y'all play on? just curious.

caesarscott
05-15-05, 09:22 PM
Mr. BarD sounds to me like a racist xenophobe. he needs to get the hell off our board

oakley
05-15-05, 09:26 PM
Look at any major tournament in America or elsewhere - where are the players from? That is where Baylor should and will (I hope) get all our players, forever.

With your thinking, Wimbledon should have an asterisk every time a British player is not the winner - same with The French Open, The US Open, The Australian Open, etc.

You don't know much about tennis and it shows.

spooky
05-15-05, 09:32 PM
We have a great coach, one of the best in the country, and his tennis program is rising like a rocket.

He's probably very good, and I hope you do keep getting better, but if your coach turns down a great European player in favor of a less talented American because, as you stated, he wants to "give American tennis players a chance," then he would immediately forfeit any claim to being a great coach.

I guarantee you if 6 European players, each of them more talented than the players you have now, rode a donkey into Boise (or however the hell you get there) and offered to play for you guys, your coach would snap them up quicker than you could blink.

The only criteria that should be used is 1) are they a quality player? 2) Are they a quality person, and 3) Are they a quality student?
If the answer is yes to all three, like it is with every one of our players (5 all-Big 12 academic players) then where they come from matters not a bit.

GO BU BEARS
05-15-05, 09:37 PM
Sorry if I hit a nerve. Yep. I lived in Europe for several years, speak some German and Spanish. My best friend is a German Biermeister from Munchen. Educated in the US. That's not the point, Baylor should give American tennis players a chance. Until you do, your championships should carry an asterisk.


Why did they let him take a seat that an American student could have taken? Man, I can't believe that German did that. An "yank" student could have been in a "yank" University had that dang german not gone.

bar4d
05-15-05, 09:46 PM
I'll try and remember some other sports high lights. First tennis. Our coach has won conference championships seven of the past eight years he coached at Boise State...nine conference championships at other schools...and two NCAA "Coach of the year" awards. He took a break from college coaching to run the USTA world junior program a few years ago. Last year he signed a top five American junior, Luke Shields and #19 and #21. This year he has signed another top five American junior to add to the team.

Boise State won the Pac 10 wrestling championships three out of the last five years. (Yes, thta's Pac 10)

Track...I believe we have three national champions this year.

Football, Boise State is #11 on the all time winniest football program in the country.

Boise State is the 2005 NCAA national debating champion.




When has Boise done **** in anything other than WAC football?

GO BU BEARS
05-15-05, 09:49 PM
I remember this one time in HS band camp.....The band director wouldn't let me play a solo because a exchange student from Japan beat me out in a play off. A TEXAS high school.....and a few months ago i missed out on a promotion because a girl from the middle east got it....it's an AMERICAN COMPANY founded in Atlanta, GA!!

Can you believe they just didn't let me have it because I was a "yank." I should get a tennis scholarship over Becker too...i know what a tennis ball is.

Wacoso
05-15-05, 09:58 PM
Boise State won the Pac 10 wrestling championships three out of the last five years. (Yes, thta's Pac 10)

Track...I believe we have three national champions this year.

Football, Boise State is #11 on the all time winniest football program in the country.

Boise State is the 2005 NCAA national debating champion.

1. And any Big XII wrestling program would stomp your ass.
2. Three national champions? Wow, big time.
3. Bullsh!t. #11 of all time? Ahead of ND, USC, UT, UT, UGA, BAMA, MICH, OSU, OU, NEB, etc.... I noticed you said winniest, should that be whiniest?
4. I think we have about 20 of these.

beardoc
05-15-05, 10:06 PM
Boise State should limit its scholarships not just to Americans, but to Idaho residents. I see little difference in a state supported school offering scholarships to out of state students and to foreign students.

BearChick
05-15-05, 10:18 PM
I'd like to see them field a team of only potatoes and Napoleon Dynamite.

I mean, if they're looking for good representatives of the state, I'd like to see them choose tried-and-true representatives, and not just hang their racket (as it were) to any ol' Idahoan who comes along. I mean, do you want someone who hasn't already proven they can handle the pressure of representing Idaho?

Wacoso
05-15-05, 10:38 PM
I'd like to see them field a team of only potatoes and Napoleon Dynamite.

I mean, if they're looking for good representatives of the state, I'd like to see them choose tried-and-true representatives, and not just hang their racket (as it were) to any ol' Idahoan who comes along. I mean, do you want someone who hasn't already proven they can handle the pressure of representing Idaho?

Half of them would have a swastika on their chest and a shaved head yelling "WHITE POWER!"

bar4d
05-15-05, 11:19 PM
Here's a few on the list.

Mich #1...ND #2...Okla #3...Bama #4...OSU #5...Texas #6...Nebraska #7...Tenn #8...USC #9...Penn St #10...BOISE STATE #11.

A few others. Florida St #12...Georgia #13...Miami #14...Auburn #18...Florida #20...Tex A & M #24...BAYLOR #81...Ohio # 91.



1. And any Big XII wrestling program would stomp your ass.
2. Three national champions? Wow, big time.
3. Bullsh!t. #11 of all time? Ahead of ND, USC, UT, UT, UGA, BAMA, MICH, OSU, OU, NEB, etc.... I noticed you said winniest, should that be whiniest?
4. I think we have about 20 of these.

Wacoso
05-15-05, 11:36 PM
Here's a few on the list.

Mich #1...ND #2...Okla #3...Bama #4...OSU #5...Texas #6...Nebraska #7...Tenn #8...USC #9...Penn St #10...BOISE STATE #11.

A few others. Florida St #12...Georgia #13...Miami #14...Auburn #18...Florida #20...Tex A & M #24...BAYLOR #81...Ohio # 91.

Let's see a link to this. I'm laughing too hard to look up one.

bar4d
05-15-05, 11:41 PM
Isn't Waco the place where all those people were burned alive in a compound ? Sorry if I have the wrong place.
Half of them would have a swastika on their chest and a shaved head yelling "WHITE POWER!"

bar4d
05-15-05, 11:54 PM
Is it wrong to give a first preference to thousands of American kids, guys and gals who have a dream of playing tennis for an education at a top rate school like Baylor...children of the men and women serving in Iraq and Afganistan ? Don't you think just maybe they should have first crack at the schollies?


UCLA and Stanford manage. The Stanford roster is made up of all Americans. UCLA has five foreign born kids and eight Americans. That's great. That's a great balance.

And by the way, Native Americans, Idahoans and Texans are Americans, like the kids from the other forty-eight states. American kids can choose where they want to attend college.
Is it wrong for a coach like Boise State's to take a stand where he openly says, "I want a national championship made up of an all American team>"
I assume that Boise State only recruits Native Americans. If a team gets state money, then I guess they ought to recruit players from only from that state. Boise should only field Idaho players in each sport. UT and A&M should not recruit a basketball or football player from outside the state because they represent a state. Baylor, on the other hand, has an message that has no boundaries. It doesn;t hurt anything that they also that their backhands are world class, too.

bar4d
05-15-05, 11:59 PM
The Boise #11...Baylor #81 football stats link.

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/misc/div_ia_winning_pct.php


Let's see a link to this. I'm laughing too hard to look up one.

spooky
05-16-05, 12:22 AM
And if we had spent most of our history playing Pocatello Tech and Western Montana Community College, I bet our winning percentage would be up there too. You've probably heard of a little thing called RPI, which they came up with just to keep little Podunk U. from claiming the national championship every year.

It's a shame you blew in here with the attitude that you did, cause alot of the folks on here do respect your football program, and generally pull for ya'll, especially when ya'll have dismembered the little purple froggies from TCU (who I might add have the same delusions of importance as you have shown.) But your little lectures have pretty much done away with that good will.

Good luck against Twin Falls Animal Husbandry College next season.

BaylorHoops02
05-16-05, 12:22 AM
Is it wrong for a coach like Boise State's to take a stand where he openly says, "I want a national championship made up of an all American team>"
its not wrong, but i doubt it will happen.

its not wrong, but its no more right than baylor wanting a national championship team made up of the best tennis players who will come here.

i doubt you can get many foreigners up to idaho, so i really understand your attitude towards this situation. you can't compete, so try to take down those who know how and are able to compete.

good luck bosie state

BaylorHoops02
05-16-05, 12:24 AM
The Boise #11...Baylor #81 football stats link.

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/misc/div_ia_winning_pct.php
thats kind of a silly argument when you consider the conferences that each participate in lol

keep trying

you are bosie state and sorry you have to live with that.

biggmatt24
05-16-05, 12:28 AM
The Boise #11...Baylor #81 football stats link.

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/misc/div_ia_winning_pct.php
Are you serious? Did you look at the link before you posted it?

Boise is ranked 11th not in all-time wins, but winning percentage. You misrepresented yourself when you said they were top 11 in all-time winningest programs. Good job on winning 68% of your games, but let's see it hold up over a century like the big boys above you.

Now run along and quit your whining.

caesarscott
05-16-05, 01:05 AM
The Potato boys were in the small college ranks until 1996. if they want to compare themselves to somebody, do it against SWT, SHSU and the like.

also, note that Potato U comes in at #111 on the All-Time win list. behind such powerhouses as UTEP, Ball State and East Carolina. :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/misc/div_ia_wins.php

bar4d
05-16-05, 09:00 AM
In fact Luke Shields, a Freshman from Grand Junction, Colorado, and his partner, Thomas Schoeck, a Junior from Germany, will be playing doubles at College Station next week. They are ranked #11 in the country.

Luke will be playing singles also.

bar4d
05-16-05, 09:31 AM
Congrats ! Baylor signed a top JUCO basketball player from Twin Falls Animal Husbandry College (aka...College of Southern Idaho)

Men's Hoops Adds Juco Star To Top-10 Class
*

Junior College star Mohamed Kone signed Wednesday to play basketball for Scott Drew's Baylor Bears.4/20/05
Junior college forward Mohamed Kone from the College of Southern Idaho has signed a National Letter of Intent to play for Baylor University, head basketball coach Scott Drew announced Wednesday. Kone's addition to Baylor's early signees last fall has boosted the 2005 signing class to a No. 7 national ranking by HoopScoop.



And if we had spent most of our history playing Pocatello Tech and Western Montana Community College, I bet our winning percentage would be up there too. You've probably heard of a little thing called RPI, which they came up with just to keep little Podunk U. from claiming the national championship every year.

It's a shame you blew in here with the attitude that you did, cause alot of the folks on here do respect your football program, and generally pull for ya'll, especially when ya'll have dismembered the little purple froggies from TCU (who I might add have the same delusions of importance as you have shown.) But your little lectures have pretty much done away with that good will.

Good luck against Twin Falls Animal Husbandry College next season.

Bear67
05-16-05, 10:17 AM
So, Bar4d, imagine with me that the number one tennis prospect in the world wants to come to Boise next year. Small problem though, he's German and your coach won't give him a free ride because the 153rd ranked player in the US wants to come also. You're telling me that your great coach would knowingly refuse to take a better player, who will light up Boise liike a neon sign, because he's not from the US? Sorry, we only admit Americans here in Boise.
I'm guessing a more likely explanation is that Boise has not attracted a great player from Germany, Sweden, etc. at this point in time. When your coach has a chance to take a great player from somewhere else in the world, just watch what happens.

BCC97
05-16-05, 10:28 AM
Boise State is the 2005 NCAA national debating champion.
Based on your posts, something you obviously had no part of. You've lost this argument. You cannot regain your credibility on this board by perpetuating a bad point of view.


Isn't Waco the place where all those people were burned alive in a compound?
Isn't Ruby Ridge the place where a white supremacist killed at least one federal officer in a week-long seige? Sorry if I have the wrong place.


Congrats ! Baylor signed a top JUCO basketball player from Twin Falls Animal Husbandry College (aka...College of Southern Idaho)

Why aren't you berating BU for this signing? Kone is a native of the Ivory Coast and a French citizen. This post seems a little hypocritical: congratulations for signing another foreing player after getting your panties in a wad because we have too many foreign players. Make up your freakin' mind.

BearChick
05-16-05, 10:48 AM
In fact Luke Shields, a Freshman from Grand Junction, Colorado, and his partner, Thomas Schoeck, a Junior from Germany, will be playing doubles at College Station next week. They are ranked #11 in the country.

Luke will be playing singles also.

Does anyone else like how the title of this post was "Lots of Euros have Played at Boise State Too" and then he goes on to mention a guy from Colorado?

Where in Europe is Colorado? Near Liechtenstein?

adubya
05-16-05, 11:18 AM
Xenophobe...A person unduly fearful or contemptuous of that which is foreign, especially of strangers or foreign peoples.

Nope...just concerned when NONE of the scholies go to Yanks.

It's not like we're going car shopping...who cares?

gowilde
05-16-05, 11:23 AM
Yes, we have foreign born athletes on our teams also. Even tennis. BUT NOT THE ENTIRE MEN'S AND WOMEN'S TEAM, track or otherwise. Baylor should maintain a balance.

Baylor's National championships should have an *asterisk...

.... *team has no Americans.

As far as top American's wanting to play for Baylor. We'll take them, are taking them, since you aren't interested in them.

Watch whats happens to Boise State next year.

>

bar4d--Now your true intentions are clear. You want to bash BU tennis because you lost.

You're just trolling.

Game. Set. Match.

gowilde
05-16-05, 11:30 AM
Isn't Waco the place where all those people were burned alive in a compound ? Sorry if I have the wrong place.

Dude--You come on our site and start trashing our tennis teams. Now you want to trash Waco (no, the Davidian disaster wasn't in Waco) and by implication BU.

Repeat after me--and I'll spell it slowly: T-R-O-L-L! :dizzy:

EagerBeaver
05-16-05, 12:19 PM
Bottom line:
You have great players from the U.S. who want to play for Baylor. You have great players from outside this country who want to play for Baylor. So what would be the smart thing to do? Just like anywhere else, applying for a job or even in life, you want the VERY BEST.

Bar4d, it's not our fault BS does not have student athletes from all over the world who want to attend your school, so don't get all pissy about it here. B!tch about it to your own boards.

bar4d
05-16-05, 12:36 PM
Wouldn't take the 153rd ranked player in the US...a top five nationally ranked junior player. You bet ! We have two now and are working on a few more.

I doubt if the #1 ranked player in the world would be messing with college. He or she would be on the pro circuit.

[QUOTE=Bear67]So, Bar4d, imagine with me that the number one tennis prospect in the world wants to come to Boise next year. Small problem though, he's German and your coach won't give him a free ride because the 153rd ranked player in the US wants to come also.

CorsicanaBear
05-16-05, 12:58 PM
RE:Yanks on Tennis Team

This might have been said before on this thread, but if so it bears repeating.

<foghornleghorn>I'd rather have furiners on the team than yankees any day.</foghornleghorn>

bar4d
05-16-05, 01:09 PM
We have our Ruby Ridge disaster. You have the Branch Davidian's of Waco disaster...and possibly another with the Warren Jeffs new Mormon polygamist settlement in Schleicher County. None of that stuff is much fun to talk about.

I wasn't trashing your tennis teams. Just made an observation there were no Americans playing, not even one. After all, Baylor is the largest Baptist University in the world. And you know how Baptist preachers feel about foreigners competing with American products.


Dude--You come on our site and start trashing our tennis teams. Now you want to trash Waco (no, the Davidian disaster wasn't in Waco) and by implication BU.

Repeat after me--and I'll spell it slowly: T-R-O-L-L! :dizzy:

bu03
05-16-05, 01:16 PM
We have our Ruby Ridge disaster. You have the Branch Davidian's of Waco disaster...and possibly another with the Warren Jeffs new Mormon polygamist settlement in Schleicher County. None of that stuff is much fun to talk about.

I wasn't trashing your tennis teams. Just made an observation there were no Americans playing, not even one. After all, Baylor is the largest Baptist University in the world. And you know how Baptist preachers feel about foreigners competing with American products.

What a complete moron. I guess "Baptist preachers" should run our tennis recruiting. :uhoh: :rolleyes:

MrGolfguy
05-16-05, 01:25 PM
And you know how Baptist preachers feel about foreigners competing with American products.
It's Baylor University not Baylor Baptist Church. Only about 40% of the current student body is Baptist.

beardoc
05-16-05, 04:55 PM
Schleicher county? isn't that an Angelo State problem?

beardoc
05-16-05, 04:58 PM
and now that I think of it, why would you mention that we are the largest Baptist university in the world, and then whine about taking students from around the world?

bar4d
05-16-05, 05:44 PM
"Most Non American's on any of the teams playing in the Sweet Sixteen"

GoBearsGo
05-16-05, 07:05 PM
Can you tell me where Baylor is breaking any rules? Is there a NCAA law that says you can not have a team made up of more than x% of foreign players?

When the NCAA says that we need to have "balance" then we will have balance. Until then we will sign the best players we can get. If you have a problem then call the NCAA and cry to them.

Yogi
05-16-05, 07:20 PM
Yes, we have foreign born athletes on our teams also. Even tennis. BUT NOT THE ENTIRE MEN'S AND WOMEN'S TEAM, track or otherwise. Baylor should maintain a balance.

Baylor's National championships should have an *asterisk...

.... *team has no Americans.

As far as top American's wanting to play for Baylor. We'll take them, are taking them, since you aren't interested in them.

Watch whats happens to Boise State next year.

>

We have All-Americans on our team. What are you talking about? ;)

BTW, I don't watch Boise State and neither does anyone else in this country. So go back to getting your jollies off our tennis program.

caesarscott
05-16-05, 07:22 PM
again i will say bar4d is a racist xenophobe. that or eating potatoes 4 times a day has done some crazy things to his brain

bugwbsax05
05-16-05, 07:36 PM
What this guy doesnt know is that we have a guy (Jon Rekewey, Nebraska) playing on our #3 doubles team. Coach Knoll goes out and takes the best athletes, that he thinks will be great role models, and great students at Baylor University whether they are american or not. The tennis game is farther along in foreign countries than it is here, so in my mind Coach Knoll is a genius. I'm sure you coach would give his whole contract to have a one-two punch of Dorsch and Becker. So dont come here and start whinning b/c we beat yalls a ss earlier in the year. Oh and by the way, you guys will never ever play us in the regular season, b/c to be quite frank, you guys arent good enough. We only play the best the nation has to offer and you guys arent there yet. So When you guys win something, then come talk to us about how we run our program.

BearChick
05-16-05, 08:12 PM
We have our Ruby Ridge disaster. You have the Branch Davidian's of Waco disaster...and possibly another with the Warren Jeffs new Mormon polygamist settlement in Schleicher County. None of that stuff is much fun to talk about.

I wasn't trashing your tennis teams. Just made an observation there were no Americans playing, not even one. After all, Baylor is the largest Baptist University in the world. And you know how Baptist preachers feel about foreigners competing with American products.

1) The Branch Davidians weren't "of" Waco. They happened to live near there. Not too much else.

2) Schleicher County is way the **** out in West Texas. Now, I know this is going to come as a shock, but you can fit about 10 Idahos in the state of Texas. Just because a county is in Texas, doesn't mean it's close to McLennan County. I would wager the new compound is a good 6-8 hours from Waco.

3) Ah, the largest Baptist University in the world. With the most worldly diverse tennis team.

4) No, funny, after 20-some-odd years in the Baptist church, I have never heard a sermon preached on this. I am going to have to talk to Dr. Young about the deficit in the theology of my youth.

You know what we need on here, with all the smilies off to the right? A TROLL emoticon. That's so awesome. We need to designate an emoticon as the universal symbol for Troll.

DickieBear
05-16-05, 09:24 PM
Glued to my seat.

Love it. Keep it going.

DickieBear
05-16-05, 09:39 PM
1) The Branch Davidians weren't "of" Waco. They happened to live near there. Not too much else.

2) Schleicher County is way the **** out in West Texas. Now, I know this is going to come as a shock, but you can fit about 10 Idahos in the state of Texas. Just because a county is in Texas, doesn't mean it's close to McLennan County. I would wager the new compound is a good 6-8 hours from Waco.

3) Ah, the largest Baptist University in the world. With the most worldly diverse tennis team.

4) No, funny, after 20-some-odd years in the Baptist church, I have never heard a sermon preached on this. I am going to have to talk to Dr. Young about the deficit in the theology of my youth.

You know what we need on here, with all the smilies off to the right? A TROLL emoticon. That's so awesome. We need to designate an emoticon as the universal symbol for Troll.

BearChick:

As a baptist, I went on a few hayrides (no dancing). I never heard of a Troll emoticon, however I trust you. You take care of the boise boy. By the way, what's the graduation rate of the mens and womens teams?

I saw the NCAAs in Tulsa and our tennis players were total class.

Bankerbear
05-16-05, 10:28 PM
this thread is pretty repetitive, but here is my two cents worth --

I think it is unAmerican to have a blue rug for football. What is that about? Damn Yankee commies---

And yes, you have Ruby Ridge and we have the Davidians. But in Texas, we have lots of other stuff---------- Dallas Cowboys, Houston Rockets (shouldn't count, they have a Chinaman), Dallas Mavericks (they should get an award since they let the foreigner go to Phoenix), the Alamo, NASA, the home of Nolan Ryan, Roger Clemens,Tris Speaker and Willie Nelson, four universities in the Big XII conference (and many more that would like to be), Texas Ranger Hall of Fame, the first hotel owned by Conrad Hilton, the largest military installation in the country, Michael Dell and Dell Computers and some guy that has a ranch near Waco but lives most of the time in DC----------I am leaving a bunch out ------------------but what does Idaho have, other than potatoes?

DickieBear
05-16-05, 10:59 PM
this thread is pretty repetitive, but here is my two cents worth --

I think it is unAmerican to have a blue rug for football. What is that about? Damn Yankee commies---

And yes, you have Ruby Ridge and we have the Davidians. But in Texas, we have lots of other stuff---------- Dallas Cowboys, Houston Rockets (shouldn't count, they have a Chinaman), Dallas Mavericks (they should get an award since they let the foreigner go to Phoenix), the Alamo, NASA, the home of Nolan Ryan, Roger Clemens,Tris Speaker and Willie Nelson, four universities in the Big XII conference (and many more that would like to be), Texas Ranger Hall of Fame, the first hotel owned by Conrad Hilton, the largest military installation in the country, Michael Dell and Dell Computers and some guy that has a ranch near Waco but lives most of the time in DC----------I am leaving a bunch out ------------------but what does Idaho have, other than potatoes?

Great job BankerBear. You did forget Georges and Jerry Jeff Walker,but not to worry.

Wacoso
05-16-05, 11:02 PM
Billly Joe Shaver, Kinky Freidman, Robert Earl Keen, Ray Wylie Hubbard, and so many more...

LordByron
05-16-05, 11:16 PM
Congrats from a Boise State fan on another Baylor trip to the sweet sixteen. We lost a close one to Tex A & M yesterday. The 4-0 score was closer than that.

Question. Why are there no Americans on your women's team...and only one on your men's team?

Just curious, but somehow that doesn't seem quite right.

We gave you guys a good match earlier in the year. Took the doubles point if I remember right and a bunch of first sets in the singles.

Our team will be much better next year and we are coming after you. The General's Army is on the move.Why are there no international players on your team???? Are there any on your track team? Canada isn't very far from your school. Why can't you attract Canadian athletes to Boise State. By the way, is your football team made up of only Idahoans?

LordByron
05-16-05, 11:31 PM
Is it wrong to give a first preference to thousands of American kids, guys and gals who have a dream of playing tennis for an education at a top rate school like Baylor...children of the men and women serving in Iraq and Afganistan ? Don't you think just maybe they should have first crack at the schollies?


UCLA and Stanford manage. The Stanford roster is made up of all Americans. UCLA has five foreign born kids and eight Americans. That's great. That's a great balance.

And by the way, Native Americans, Idahoans and Texans are Americans, like the kids from the other forty-eight states. American kids can choose where they want to attend college.
Is it wrong for a coach like Boise State's to take a stand where he openly says, "I want a national championship made up of an all American team>"But according to your logic (and I use the word loosely) shouldn't you only be recruiting Idahoans for your football team? How many out of state players were on last year's football team?

bar4d
05-17-05, 09:50 AM
I was aware of him. Baylor still gets the award for the most Non Yankee team in the tourney. How many Americans on the Women's team?

As far as Idaho vs. Texas...or the guy who claims to be a Texan who is really a Yankee from New England...don't really want to go there. We do have tall mountains and thousands of miles of trout filled streams.

Don't want to talk football with you folks. I doubt very much if you want to go there either.

Back to tennis. There is a good chance Boise will play the Baylor in regular season next year and each year thereafter. We will meet in tourneys along the way. Our coach likes to play in a bunch. Four this year. This year Boise played you. Took the doubles point and gave you a BIG scare. Even your coach said so.


What this guy doesnt know is that we have a guy (Jon Rekewey, Nebraska) playing on our #3 doubles team. Coach Knoll goes out and takes the best athletes, that he thinks will be great role models, and great students at Baylor University whether they are american or not. The tennis game is farther along in foreign countries than it is here, so in my mind Coach Knoll is a genius. I'm sure you coach would give his whole contract to have a one-two punch of Dorsch and Becker. So dont come here and start whinning b/c we beat yalls a ss earlier in the year. Oh and by the way, you guys will never ever play us in the regular season, b/c to be quite frank, you guys arent good enough. We only play the best the nation has to offer and you guys arent there yet. So When you guys win something, then come talk to us about how we run our program.

BCC97
05-17-05, 10:13 AM
I guess the 4-1 score at the team indoors (match between Baylor and BS) wasn't as close as the score indicated (much like the 4-0 score to A&M), eh?

Here's what Knoll (that would be our coach) said after the match: "Boise played great. I’ve got to give them all the credit in the world. They played with more energy than we did in the doubles…It seemed like we didn’t do a very good job closing out matches. That’s something we got to better. Everyone is good here, so you can’t take anything for granted. You’ve got to be ready to go. We just struggled to find any rhythm today."

Jack Bauer
05-17-05, 10:53 AM
I was aware of him. Baylor still gets the award for the most Non Yankee team in the tourney. How many Americans on the Women's team?


OH JEEZ - I CAN"T HOLD BACK ANY LONGER...you are such a dimwit

1) You are such a hypocrite!! You want it both ways.
You have 4/10 male and 5/8 female players that are foreign.

"Well yes we do have SOME foreign players on our team, but Baylor has the MOST so they deserve an asterisk on their championship."

That's like saying "I don't believe in adultery, but I only do it a little bit."

2 ) You also asked "Why can't Baylor give Americans a chance.." Who the he!! said the coach didn't give them a chance. Do you think the coach had a sign on the tennis court that said 'Foreign players ONLY allowed on Baylor team'. Of course not, he let everybody tryout and then picked the best players.

3) Who made you boss to to make the NCAA tennis rules that there has to be a balance of foreign and American players? What is the balance - 25, 50, 75%?

4) Are you against buying foreign products, outsourcing, free trade as well? I've got four Indians in my office - shall I tell them to pack up and go back home?

Yogi
05-17-05, 11:03 AM
I don't put an asterisk next to foreign players' names because most universities serve more than just American students.

Even at Boise State, I can guarantee you that not everyone in the biology, chemistry, physics, or computer science departments is American.

Baylor coach Matt Knoll is American, and if there is an American who is better than our foreign recruits, we will recruit him. After we hopefully win our second National Championship in a row, more Americans will be interested in coming to Baylor.

But they'll still have to compete with the best in the World - which is something they wouldn't get to do at Boise State. ;)

JETHRO
05-17-05, 12:09 PM
Only one Yank on your tennis teams ?

Weil wir die nationalen blinden Meisterschaften gewinnen!

CammoTX
05-17-05, 12:59 PM
Only one Yank on your tennis teams ?

Weil wir die nationalen blinden Meisterschaften gewinnen!

Reminds me of the Family Guy clip where Hitler has a talk show. "For tickets to Hitler call 1-800 untcomen mit fruedent zet gernd hast..."

BUWebguy
05-17-05, 01:05 PM
Wouldn't take the 153rd ranked player in the US...a top five nationally ranked junior player. You bet ! We have two now and are working on a few more.

That's the reason Knoll has stuck with international players. When he started at Baylor in the mid-90s, Baylor men's tennis was AWFUL. Like, bottom three in the conference 49 times in the last 50 years or so -- no exaggeration. He couldn't recruit good American players -- they all wanted to go to "name" programs like USC or Tennessee -- so he recruited good international players.

After quickly improving the program and winning the Big 12 in 2000, he thought Baylor could start getting those top Americans. That didn't prove to be the case; the top players still wanted to go to those name schools. At the same time, his first international players were graduating but were urging their friends back home to come to Baylor, creating a pipeline (starting with Johannes Michalsky and Reiner Neurohr from Germany). That made the international recruiting even easier.

I don't know how Baylor might fare with the top HS Americans now; I haven't been close to the program since 2000. While there is some virtue to giving scholarships to Americans, I think Baylor (as a university) does a pretty good job of that outside of the tennis programs. In fact, if anything, Baylor is probably a little too homogeneous; it needs some diversity, even if that just means adding 10 or 15 Europeans to play tennis. And, as many others have pointed out, it certainly fits the mission of the school to offer an opportunity to people (regardless of ethnicity) to advance themselves in a Christian atmosphere.

beardoc
05-17-05, 02:19 PM
ditto for the occasional Senegalese, Australian, Finn, etc in basketball.

bar4d
05-17-05, 03:51 PM
I understand more of the "Why" Baylor has all off shore kids. But I bet, if your coach wanted too, more top Americans would chose Baylor. As far as our program. We have three Germans, Thomas Schoeck, a junior at #2 singles and #1 doubles (#11 national Ranking) with Luke Shields, Freshman, an American. Luke originally was headed to Florida or his choice of other big name schools. When he found out about our coach returning, he changed his mind and came to Boise State. Another five top American player committed last month because of our coach.

Next season Boise State will be playing four sophomore top 20 Americans. Coach has more slots to fill.

The other two Germans are, Nils Klemen, #4 singles, injured all year, and Beck Roghar #6 singles, senior, played injured. #3 singles was another senior, Matias Silva from Peru.

I never said a team must play all Americans.


That's the reason Knoll has stuck with international players. When he started at Baylor in the mid-90s, Baylor men's tennis was AWFUL. Like, bottom three in the conference 49 times in the last 50 years or so -- no exaggeration. He couldn't recruit good American players -- they all wanted to go to "name" programs like USC or Tennessee -- so he recruited good international players.

After quickly improving the program and winning the Big 12 in 2000, he thought Baylor could start getting those top Americans. That didn't prove to be the case; the top players still wanted to go to those name schools. At the same time, his first international players were graduating but were urging their friends back home to come to Baylor, creating a pipeline (starting with Johannes Michalsky and Reiner Neurohr from Germany). That made the international recruiting even easier.

I don't know how Baylor might fare with the top HS Americans now; I haven't been close to the program since 2000. While there is some virtue to giving scholarships to Americans, I think Baylor (as a university) does a pretty good job of that outside of the tennis programs. In fact, if anything, Baylor is probably a little too homogeneous; it needs some diversity, even if that just means adding 10 or 15 Europeans to play tennis. And, as many others have pointed out, it certainly fits the mission of the school to offer an opportunity to people (regardless of ethnicity) to advance themselves in a Christian atmosphere.

Jack Bauer
05-17-05, 04:06 PM
I never thought in a 1000 years that there would be a post about

- Boise State tennis fans upset about Baylor not having enough American players on their team. :lol:

ChipOC
05-17-05, 04:14 PM
Troll alert!

caesarscott
05-17-05, 04:36 PM
http://www.cit.gu.edu.au/~anthony/icons/large/troll.jpg

This is a troll

BaylorHoops02
05-17-05, 06:10 PM
"Most Non American's on any of the teams playing in the Sweet Sixteen"
this post takes the cake
you're right - baylor playing in the sweet 16 with international players who win...boise state sitting at home with americans who don't

you pick what you'd rather have :tongue:

SoTexBear
05-17-05, 06:26 PM
Congrats from a Boise State fan on another Baylor trip to the sweet sixteen. We lost a close one to Tex A & M yesterday. The 4-0 score was closer than that.

Question. Why are there no Americans on your women's team...and only one on your men's team?

Just curious, but somehow that doesn't seem quite right.

We gave you guys a good match earlier in the year. Took the doubles point if I remember right and a bunch of first sets in the singles.

Our team will be much better next year and we are coming after you. The General's Army is on the move.

"Make disciples...of all the nations" Doesn't say anything about keeping things in America, does it?

bar4d
05-17-05, 07:20 PM
Because we win the national blind championships ??

Was blendet Meisterschaften bedeuten ?

Haben sie kein Amerikaner auf der Meisterschaftmannschaft bedeutet ?


Only one Yank on your tennis teams ?

Weil wir die nationalen blinden Meisterschaften gewinnen!

sic'emchops
05-17-05, 07:56 PM
Don't want to talk football with you folks. I doubt very much if you want to go there either.



I'll talk football...because you're all ready whipped in the tennis talking department (we sport the 54 match winning streak to prove it)...let's compare our football history dating back to 1899 which includes 16 bowl games...6 SWC championships...and 501 wins vs. your blue turf boys' 33 years of football...295 wins and few WAC titles

those stats mean nothing b/c we both have ZERO national titles (just like your tennis team)...so whenever you get some history...or maybe 500 wins...then come back and post something on here

but for now...find something better to do with your time than start such nonsense as you have done with this thread...maybe you could hang out with your american jr tennis player Luke...you seem to love him a lot

Yogi
05-17-05, 09:20 PM
Would Steffi Graf count as an American tennis player or a German tennis player?

bar4d
05-17-05, 09:28 PM
Boise State has a rich football history with many conference titles, including two national titles, one at the Junior college level, and one at the D1-AA level.

Boise State has been in the WAC since 2000, has won the last three WAC titles, and is undefeated in WAC play during those years. Their record during that period is 55 wins and 9 loss's. They have ended the season ranked 15th or higher in each of the past three seasons, and are pre-ranked as high as 12th this year.

Baylor is a recent addition to big time college football, joining the Big 12 in 1996. Their record since 2000 is not that impressive with 11 wins and 42 loss's. They ended the 2004 season 111th out of 117. This year they are pre-ranked 81st.

Baylor and Boise have something in common. They both were state schools in the beginning. They both were all girls schools in the beginning.

Boise was an Espiscopalian all girls school. Baylor was was simply known as Baylor Female College, later, after merging with Waco University, the name was changed to University of Mary Hardin. Boise would love to play Baylor sometime in the future.

Hopefully, my guy Luke, will get a chance at your Euro's in doubles and singles soon.


I'll talk football...because you're all ready whipped in the tennis talking department (we sport the 54 match winning streak to prove it)...let's compare our football history dating back to 1899 which includes 16 bowl games...6 SWC championships...and 501 wins vs. your blue turf boys' 33 years of football...295 wins and few WAC titles

those stats mean nothing b/c we both have ZERO national titles (just like your tennis team)...so whenever you get some history...or maybe 500 wins...then come back and post something on here

but for now...find something better to do with your time than start such nonsense as you have done with this thread...maybe you could hang out with your american jr tennis player Luke...you seem to love him a lot

beardoc
05-17-05, 09:53 PM
Baylor and Boise have something in common. They both were state schools in the beginning. They both were all girls schools in the beginning.

Boise was an Espiscopalian all girls school. Baylor was was simply known as Baylor Female College, later, after merging with Waco University, the name was changed to University of Mary Hardin. Boise would love to play Baylor sometime in the future.

Say what?

Yogi
05-17-05, 10:21 PM
We've been had.

You can throw this one in the Crap Filter.

sic'emchops
05-17-05, 10:31 PM
Baylor is a recent addition to big time college football, joining the Big 12 in 1996. .

the same year that texas, texas a&m, texas tech, oklahoma, oklahoma st, colorado, nebraska, iowa st, missouri, kansas and kansas st were all admitted into the big 12

so i guess they too are recent additions to big time college football...i'm sure they'd all love to see you try to convince them that the SWC and big 8 weren't big time college football

oh wait, you don't know what big time college football is, your team plays in the wac...not a part of the bcs even

and to keep this "tennis related" thread going i leave you with a baylor tennis motto "you got served!"

Snow Bear
05-17-05, 11:23 PM
LOL!! bar4d is trying to tell us about Baylor's history and is making himself out to be a damn fool.

bar4d, Baylor University (called by that name since the beginning) is the oldest school in texas and was chartered by the Republic of Texas in 1845. Baylor is the world's largest Baptist University and was founded in Independence Texas but merged with Waco University and retained its name. Baylor was NEVER an all girls school. Now, you may be thinking of our little sister in Belton Texas known as University of Mary Hardin Baylor (Div III), once called Baylor Women's College.

Please PLEASE don't come to our BBS, complaining about out team that is better than yours and then attempt to relate our schools through false information. But, thanks for the info about your school being an all girls school so I can laugh a little when I hear something about Boise State.

namechange
05-17-05, 11:33 PM
Look, I understand what you're saying...we've had this conversation before, but the fault lies with American tennis and the USTA rather than BU. There aren't enough quality, young American players - whether that's the "Tiger factor" meaning that if kids are playing a country club sport then it's golf and not tennis or that the top Americans (Roddick, Dent, etc.) are turning pro rather than going to school I don't know?

However, other coaches have tried to say that they will do it with an all-American team, too...we've been ripped by Tilley (Illinois), Flach (formerly of Vanderbilt until he bailed on them this year), and cASS (A&M) specifically for our foreign recruiting...and then, they went out and recruited foreign players! Illinois added two very good players (Anderson from South Africa and Jones from New Zealand), and TAMU has guys from Croatia and France currently playing for them. I will admit that Vandy has an all-American lineup still this year, but they're sitting at home right now, too.

As for Stanford, they played in Waco, and while they're all from America, their lineup consists of Lee Chang, Phil Kao, Nico Martinez, Phil Sheng, James Won, and Jon Wong to name a few...why is it different that their parents or parents' parents (or further back) came to America and are now from California or another state rather than if they came from Asia or somewhere else?? I just don't see the difference - I'm thrilled for Stanford that they have all Americans, I'd be thrilled if they were all foreign players - it just doesn't make a difference to me...you recruit the best talent you can wherever they are...it's a great blueprint for success as Coach Knoll has shown. For example, Benjamin Becker is a 3-time Academic All Big-12 member and oh yeah, NEVER LOST A BIG 12 MATCH!!! Why WOULDN'T you take him...because he's from Germany?? I realize that your point is not that a team shouldn't have any foreign players, but should have balance, but again, if you have the opportunity to take any player, you take the BEST one, as long as they are of strong character. I have had a few of our players in class and they are not only strong students academically, but great people as well.

I'm incredibly proud of this team - I think if you were here you would realize that these are guys (and girls) that we will be proud of not only on the court as they represent BU, but long into the future as they go on in other vocations. For example, a guy that really helped get BU solidified and was our first of now 6 straight Big 12 freshman of the Year awards, Zoltan Papp, graduated two years ago and I believe I read that he is still in Dallas leading tennis camps, etc. So what if he was originally from Hungary - isn't this what America is all about? Pawel Gajdzik (originally from Poland) was a standout for us as well and is now working on his PhD at BU, I believe. These are great success stories both on the court, in the classroom and in life, and I'm incredibly proud to call them Baylor Bears. As many have attested, this is also what BU is about - reaching the world.

Hope that helps explain why we're a bit frustrated by the "asterisk" comment - we've done nothing illegal, we've simply recruited the best players -- wherever they're from...we recruited one of the top kids from Colorado (Corey Ross), one of the top kids from Texas (Jason Gould), one of the top kids from Nebraska (Jon Reckeway)...two of them decided that they wouldn't see enough court time and transferred...until we get Americans that can beat out foreign athletes, I hope our recruiting efforts remain the exact same, and I don't see what your point is - we aren't intentionally keeping U.S. players from playing here - we simply can't find any that want to be here that are good enough to beat any of our other recruits out!

Way too long of a post, but I felt it was warranted - we're WAY too proud of this team to have to continue to listen to crap like "USA" chants that the Aggies have thrown at us in the past. Very classless. These are awesome guys who work incredibly hard in the classroom, on the court and are stand-up guys off the court - they deserve our admiration. Sic 'em!

BaylorHoops02
05-17-05, 11:51 PM
go lars ;)

oakley
05-18-05, 12:26 AM
namechange -

wonderful post; couldn't agree more.

caesarscott
05-18-05, 01:04 AM
Look, I understand what you're saying...we've had this conversation before, but the fault lies with American tennis and the USTA rather than BU. There aren't enough quality, young American players - whether that's the "Tiger factor" meaning that if kids are playing a country club sport then it's golf and not tennis or that the top Americans (Roddick, Dent, etc.) are turning pro rather than going to school I don't know?

However, other coaches have tried to say that they will do it with an all-American team, too...we've been ripped by Tilley (Illinois), Flach (formerly of Vanderbilt until he bailed on them this year), and cASS (A&M) specifically for our foreign recruiting...and then, they went out and recruited foreign players! Illinois added two very good players (Anderson from South Africa and Jones from New Zealand), and TAMU has guys from Croatia and France currently playing for them. I will admit that Vandy has an all-American lineup still this year, but they're sitting at home right now, too.

As for Stanford, they played in Waco, and while they're all from America, their lineup consists of Lee Chang, Phil Kao, Nico Martinez, Phil Sheng, James Won, and Jon Wong to name a few...why is it different that their parents or parents' parents (or further back) came to America and are now from California or another state rather than if they came from Asia or somewhere else?? I just don't see the difference - I'm thrilled for Stanford that they have all Americans, I'd be thrilled if they were all foreign players - it just doesn't make a difference to me...you recruit the best talent you can wherever they are...it's a great blueprint for success as Coach Knoll has shown. For example, Benjamin Becker is a 3-time Academic All Big-12 member and oh yeah, NEVER LOST A BIG 12 MATCH!!! Why WOULDN'T you take him...because he's from Germany?? I realize that your point is not that a team shouldn't have any foreign players, but should have balance, but again, if you have the opportunity to take any player, you take the BEST one, as long as they are of strong character. I have had a few of our players in class and they are not only strong students academically, but great people as well.

I'm incredibly proud of this team - I think if you were here you would realize that these are guys (and girls) that we will be proud of not only on the court as they represent BU, but long into the future as they go on in other vocations. For example, a guy that really helped get BU solidified and was our first of now 6 straight Big 12 freshman of the Year awards, Zoltan Papp, graduated two years ago and I believe I read that he is still in Dallas leading tennis camps, etc. So what if he was originally from Hungary - isn't this what America is all about? Pawel Gajdzik (originally from Poland) was a standout for us as well and is now working on his PhD at BU, I believe. These are great success stories both on the court, in the classroom and in life, and I'm incredibly proud to call them Baylor Bears. As many have attested, this is also what BU is about - reaching the world.

Hope that helps explain why we're a bit frustrated by the "asterisk" comment - we've done nothing illegal, we've simply recruited the best players -- wherever they're from...we recruited one of the top kids from Colorado (Corey Ross), one of the top kids from Texas (Jason Gould), one of the top kids from Nebraska (Jon Reckeway)...two of them decided that they wouldn't see enough court time and transferred...until we get Americans that can beat out foreign athletes, I hope our recruiting efforts remain the exact same, and I don't see what your point is - we aren't intentionally keeping U.S. players from playing here - we simply can't find any that want to be here that are good enough to beat any of our other recruits out!

Way too long of a post, but I felt it was warranted - we're WAY too proud of this team to have to continue to listen to crap like "USA" chants that the Aggies have thrown at us in the past. Very classless. These are awesome guys who work incredibly hard in the classroom, on the court and are stand-up guys off the court - they deserve our admiration. Sic 'em!Its Tree top tall and Over the Wal... GONE. A Grandslam Home run for Namechange.

Intellectuals 147 - Trolls 0

bar4d
05-18-05, 09:36 AM
I agree with what you say top to bottom. Our International players are not just good athletes, but outstanding young men. There were four on the team this year. There will be two next year unless coach brings in more. I have never said BU should be all American. Even though you have the most "International players" in the Sweet Sixteen, there are other teams with almost as many.

Fault for the current trend does lie with American tennis, the USTA...and the NCAA.

There is another reason the Americans are being squeezed out. An unfair advantage enjoyed by International Players for some reason ignored by the NCAA. It concerns pro tournament play, mostly abroad.

The international player influence on American college tennis has good points. They bring the level of tennis up. Many are older, more physically mature, and have more experience. There are rules in place to limit these older players who play on the pro circuit and then come to USA to study and play tennis. I believe NCAA rules make these players sit out a year before they can play.

Here is the rub. Many of the international players at many colleges in the US have been able to earn money and skirt around the NCAA rules on mandatory amateurism. They play for clubs who pay them under the table. American players can play in pro tournaments. If they win, God forbid what the NCAA would do to them if they accepted prize money.

There is more to this story than this, but I'll leave it there.

I too am surprised at what happened to this thread. Thanks for letting me stop by, and good luck to BU in the tourney.

SirBearALot
05-18-05, 11:04 AM
Well , I think anybody that lives outside of TEXAS is a foreigner...

YYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!

Yogi
05-18-05, 01:42 PM
bar4d, if you are a serious poster, please do more historical research before you type.

Baylor Female College hasn't been part of Baylor University since 1886. It is now the University of Mary-Hardin Baylor.

Baylor University was chartered in 1845, is the oldest existing university in the State of Texas, and began top level athletics around 1899. Since 1915, we have been a member two conferences, both far more competitive than any conference in which Boise State has ever participated.

GovernorBill
05-18-05, 10:39 PM
...in 1866 under the direction of Horace Clark who was appointed the head of the Female Division in 1851 after Rufus Burleson thought it best to separate the Men and Women of Baylor after the first 6 years of coeducational instruction. Mr. Clark butted heads with William Carey Crane, and I think was encouraged to "take his ball and go."

Where does this Idahoan get this crazy idea that we were EVER a state school? Perhaps just because we were charted by the Republic of Texas? Heck our school even preceeded the organization of the Southern Baptist Convention by a few months.

Tiny Elvis
05-19-05, 08:33 AM
Betcha this is an Aggie troll in disguise...some clown that did about 10 minutes research on the Boise State site and jumped over here to try to stir things up.

Old300Bear
05-19-05, 09:10 AM
My friend Tiny is a very wise man.

MGMBear
05-20-05, 06:51 PM
Are we really sure that this is not the Aggy head coach. This sounds a lot like his argument in 2003.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/other/2003-05-12-tennis-pros_x.htm

Yogi
05-20-05, 07:57 PM
Governor. I believe you. I thought that was right, but I got the info off www.baylor.edu.

MGMBear
05-20-05, 08:02 PM
The article proves this point. In 2003 it was proven that BU is doing nothing wrong, which means in 2005 BU is doing nothing illegal. So Bar4d deal with your second rate tennis team's lack of success in the tournament. I hope that after Louisville beat you in the bowl game, you looked at their roster to make sure that all of their players were from Louisville.

bar4d
05-24-05, 10:17 PM
I just this minute see that UCLA won. I thought it was in the bag for Baylor.

On to the singles and doubles.

Next year you will see the Boise State "mostly Americans" in the round of sixteen.

JudgeBaylor
05-24-05, 11:22 PM
Seriously, VTE is the only perceptive person posting on this thread - this is such a transparent poke at Knoll et al by a chicken-sh$t ag or whorn. Get real bar4d and try to get your team better so we don't blank you in the tourney next year.

Aray
05-24-05, 11:27 PM
I just this minute see that UCLA won. I thought it was in the bag for Baylor.

On to the singles and doubles.

Next year you will see the Boise State "mostly Americans" in the round of sixteen.


Name 5 current American mens tennis players off the top of your head. Exclude Andy Roddick and Andre Agassi

True Grit
05-25-05, 07:52 AM
Ummmm,

Did you see the names and ages of the UCLA team? Seem pretty Euro to me.

bar4d
05-25-05, 08:34 AM
From an article by Janis Combs "Abolish the scholarship".


I believe the true culprit is American college tennis. Foreign players have previously benefited in two ways by playing on the pro tour as well as taking part in our tennis scholarship system. They tried their guts out on the tour from ages 14 - 20 and usually the foreign player would set a goal to be in the top 200 in the world by age 19 (women) or 20 (men). If they did not attain that goal, they came over and got a free education in America via the tennis scholarship. Now this rule has changed and foreign players will no longer be allowed to come running over here as much after they quit their pro careers. They must lose one year of eligibility for every year they are on the tour. This is in effect for 1998 (reference: Tennis Magazine article by Brian Cleary).This will only further weaken the quality of American tennis as our main competition will be gone.

If American players would turn pro at 14 or 15 years of age they would be able to start earning money for their efforts (top players throughout the world are competing regularly in pro events from the age of 14 years on). Motivation would increase as our young players would seek out the prize money events available here the U.S. and Europe as well as attain early preparation for their pro careers by playing men and women's pro qualifying events which helps the player attain a world ranking as well as money to help further their careers. Some would also receive sponsorship money to help pay expenses. Some players would be picked up by management companies which would also help their careers.

In Europe there is a vast training ground for young tennis players in the form of team tennis (unlike the club format and the team tennis we have in this country) as well as numerous pro tournaments. There are 8 levels of teams in Germany, the top three paying many of their players for participation. There are also different levels of teams for Juniors, as well as their own sanctioned Junior tournaments throughout Germany. It is not uncommon for Juniors to play on a Junior team as well as an adult team at the same time. Boris Becker and Steffi Graf also participate in German Team Tennis. It is not uncommon to see 15 - 18 year-olds receiving money for their efforts in German Team Tennis. Recruitment for players is not uncommon in Europe. The young American player cannot get recruited until after college (23 - 24 years old).

Because our college players are constantly trying to maintain amateur status, they literally watch their pro tennis careers pass them by.

It is against NCAA rules to compete in German Team Tennis while participating on a college team, or before competing on a college team.

Europeans are beginning to earn money by the age of 14 if they are especially talented. This increases the motivational level of the player whereas players in America are actually demotivated. They can't earn money, they are only playing to get that scholarship so mom and dad won't have to pay. Teaching pros will even say as a pitch to the parents to spend $20,000 with them for lessons and save $60,000 in college fees via the scholarship. The truth of the matter is you probably don't need to spend so much with "the pro" if the kid would just get out and practice 3 or 4 hours a day on their own and play in as many tournaments as possible. We just have some unmotivated kids who either never really outgrew the day care environment and/or our antiquated system is killing them. The cushy workouts that these kids go to are disgusting, why don't they just pick up the phone and organize their own workout. Whoever heard of paying to practice, only a money hungry teaching pro lacking in ethics could think up such a thing.

bar4d
05-26-05, 12:52 PM
With a little luck, it might happen.

Boise's freshman, Luke Shield's knocked off Duke's #5, Ludovic Walter, in straight sets today...6-4...6-2.

All America his first year playing in college. Not bad for a home schooled kid from Grand Junction, Colorado...who had to hitch a ride, sleeping in a car, from time to time to get to tournaments.

Jack Bauer
05-26-05, 01:25 PM
Next year you will see the Boise State "mostly Americans" in the round of sixteen.

This has to be the stupidest trash-talk comment EVER. Five of your eight female tennis players are FOREIGNERS. I take it that you don't support your women's team since they are not "mostly Americans".

I really hope the women's singles finals will be Zemenova vs. Zalameda just to see you throw a hissy-fit. :cry: :cry:

bar4d
05-26-05, 02:14 PM
I don't follow Boise State womens tennis and am surprised to see the 5-3 IP's to American players, I just emailed the coach to see what the future looks like.

A question for you. Is it a bad thing to root for Americans vs. International players?

Once again, Boise State's men's team has International players on their roster now. Luke Shield's NCAA doubles partner, Thomas Schoeck, is from Germany. It's roster dominance by foreign players that bothers me. Like Baylor's 9-1.


This has to be the stupidest trash-talk comment EVER. Five of your eight female tennis players are FOREIGNERS. I take it that you don't support your women's team since they are not "mostly Americans".

I really hope the women's singles finals will be Zemenova vs. Zalameda just to see you throw a hissy-fit. :cry: :cry:

D. C. Bear
05-26-05, 02:18 PM
Is it a bad thing to root for Americans vs. International players?

In college sports, it's a little stupid to cheer for individual players based on their nationality, but not immoral.

bar4d
05-26-05, 02:31 PM
If I didn't know either player...and one was American and one was German...I would root for the American...just as the German would root for his countryman.

Someone asked me if I had a Yank on my team.

Boise State has "Mostly Americans"...six. There are two Germans, one Peruvian, and an Australian...all outstanding individuals.

MrGolfguy
05-26-05, 02:44 PM
Boise's freshman, Luke Shield's knocked off Duke's #5, Ludovic Walter, in straight sets today...6-4...6-2.
May 'The Force' be with you Luke.

Jack Bauer
05-26-05, 02:45 PM
A question for you. Is it a bad thing to root for Americans vs. International players?

Once again, Boise State's men's team has International players on their roster now. Luke Shield's NCAA doubles partner, Thomas Schoeck, is from Germany. It's roster dominance by foreign players that bothers me. Like Baylor's 9-1.

BAR - you are thinking of the OLYMPICS. That is where athletes play for their country. So yes, in the Olympics I would cheer for an American since they are playing for the USA.

Now try to follow me on this... the NCAA tournament is being played by athletes for their UNIVERSITIES, not COUNTRIES. So I would cheer for Baylor players over another team, because any victory is a reflection on the school.
They don't play the German national anthem at the NCAAs if a German player from Baylor were to win...

I really hope you can get the Boise State women's coach fired for having more foreigners than Americans on their team...otherwise your selective outrage is trivial.

bar4d
05-26-05, 02:56 PM
No outrage. Don't want the coach fired. However it is sad that a coach feels the pressure to win is so great he must illiminate 90% of the American kids.

Just think it's cool to see American's excell over International players. Just think it is kinda' neat that a coach makes a concerted effort to put together a team of mostly American kids.

Jack Bauer
05-26-05, 03:13 PM
No outrage. Don't want the coach fired. However it is sad that a coach feels the pressure to win is so great he must illiminate 90% of the American kids.

Just think it's cool to see American's excell over International players. Just think it is kinda' neat that a coach makes a concerted effort to put together a team of mostly American kids.

And please confirm that you also don't believe ANY foreigners should be admitted to American colleges since they are taking slots/scholarships away from American students....

bar4d
05-26-05, 07:34 PM
I know I'm bugging the heck out of you folks. A few more days and I'll be gone until a future BU-BSU tennis match.

Anyway, Coach said he just signed three American ladies to go with the three in Boise now. That makes the gals team "mostly Americamns " also for next year.


I don't follow Boise State womens tennis and am surprised to see the 5-3 IP's to American players, I just emailed the coach to see what the future looks like.

A question for you. Is it a bad thing to root for Americans vs. International players?

Once again, Boise State's men's team has International players on their roster now. Luke Shield's NCAA doubles partner, Thomas Schoeck, is from Germany. It's roster dominance by foreign players that bothers me. Like Baylor's 9-1.

Jack Bauer
05-26-05, 08:05 PM
I know I'm bugging the heck out of you folks. A few more days and I'll be gone until a future BU-BSU tennis match.

Anyway, Coach said he just signed three American ladies to go with the three in Boise now. That makes the gals team "mostly Americamns " also for next year.

You are competing with UABPIKE for most annyong poster on BF. Come back when Boise State is playing Baylor. And good luck on getting that * put in the record books... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

91Bear
05-26-05, 08:56 PM
Come back when your school is known for something other than blue astroturf.

BaylorHoops02
05-26-05, 09:01 PM
i dont think youll be coming back after a bu/bsu match becuase i would imagine you will be too busy crying after a 4-0 loss